From: Chuck Simmons
Organization: You jest.
X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.0.33 i586)
Subject: Re: American vs foreign electrical parts and installations
References: <3D874DAA.F82953BD@mfi.net> <3D88C29C.BFD4E2F5@mfi.net>
Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 00:51:49 GMT
NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 17:51:49 PDT
"Michael A. Terrell" wrote:
> Andrew Gabriel wrote:
> > In article ,
> > Daniel Haude writes:
> > > In Germany (don't know about the rest of Europe) there's no house that
> > > DOESN't have 400V 3p at least into the basement and often into the
> > > individual flats.
> > I don't know about Germany specifically, but in a number of
> > EU countries, there is a single phase limit, above which you
> > will need to switch to 3-phase supply. In the UK, this is 100A,
> > so if you need more than 100A service, you will normally have
> > to go 3-phase, but this is not common as 100A is normally
> > enough. In some other EU countries, this is as low as 25A,
> > in which case most houses will have 3-phase.
> > In pretty much all of Europe, 3-phase is run in the street
> > (except for sparse rural areas), so it isn't difficult to
> > supply. What I notice in the US is that you don't normally
> > get more than 1 phase run in a street (another in a different
> > street, etc), which would make 3-phase supply to a house much
> > harder (not to mention that the US can't do neighbourhood
> > distribution at 120V anyway so poles are dotted with tin can
> > transformers, whereas neighbourhood distribution at the direct
> > 230/400V mains is the norm in the EU).
> > --
> > Andrew Gabriel
> You have the advantage of lower voltage drops by using a single
> transformer (AKA: Pole Pig) for a small group of homes. If one fails it
> only affects the houses on a single transformer. Some homes do have
> three phase run past them. It depends on when the local distribution
> system was built, or last upgraded. Since you can buy almost any piece
> of equipment you need for 120 or 240 volt operation.
> Industrial equipment usually would not be used in a residence, unless
> it is very quiet, and the operation doesn't require a permit from the
As far as I know, there is no EPA permit required for machine tools. A
friend of mine has a small home machine shop with a 15HP CNC mill, a 30
inch swing gear head lathe (20 HP), a German made toolroom vertical mill
(10 HP), a 12 inch swing Hardinge dovetail bed lathe (5 HP) and typical
other stuff such as drill presses, saws, welders some of them 3 phase.
He can't get 3 phase service economically so he uses small phase
converters for everything below 10 HP and a large rotary phase converter
for the big tools (the rotary phase converter handles starting surges
that the smaller phase converter boxes can't handle). It is hard to tell
that the machines run from a single phase service since the phase
converters work well enough that you can throw the reversing switch on a
machine and the spindle reverses immediatly. Even the large lathe with a
heavy chuck and work on the spindle.
I'm not sure how the EPA could develop any interest in such a tiny
machine shop for private use. In fact, OSHA is out of the picture as
well because the shop is a home shop without employees.
... The times have been,
That, when the brains were out,
the man would die. ... Macbeth
Chuck Simmons firstname.lastname@example.org