References: <3D959025.284F175B@verizon.net> <firstname.lastname@example.org>
Subject: Re: [NEWS]: Probe: U.S. Knew of Jet Terror Plots
NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 03:25:02 GMT
Organization: MediaCom High Speed Internet
Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 03:25:02 GMT
Vince Brannigan wrote:
> Vince Brannigan wrote:
> For those who would like to under stand the difference between facts
> and guilt
> Ex parte Garland (US Sup. Ct) 1866
> A pardon reaches both the punishment prescribed for the offence and
> the guilt of the offender; and when the pardon is full, it releases
> the punishment and blots out of existence the guilt, so that in the
> eye of the law the offender is as innocent as if he had never
> committed the offence. If granted before conviction, it prevents any
> of the penalties and disabilities consequent upon conviction from
> attaching; if granted after conviction, it removes the penalties and
> disabilities, and restores him to all his civil rights; it makes him,
> as it were, a new man, and gives him a new credit and capacity
> Guilt is therefore a simple legal declaration, not a "fact".
The only thing wrong with your use of this case is that it destroys your
argument about a conviction being required for it to be a crime. It bolts
out the guilt, and then describes how, before or after a conviction. So you
can have a crime without a conviction, otherwise you could only have a
pardon after the conviction.
Thousands of crimes occur everyday and no one is arrested. That does not
change the fact that a crime occurred.
Lets take one of your examples about Murder, and if there was justification.
Lets change it a little. Billy walks up and shots Mary in the head. Billy
is examined and found to be legally incompetent to stand trial. No trial no
conviction, Billy is in the nut house Mary is dead. There was no
justification, no accident(manslaughter), no legal defenses to Murder. We
don't even go to the issue of Not Guilty be reason of insanity because of
the incompetent he never even goes to trial. Does that mean no crime. I
don't think so.